Make Trades Great Again
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Make Trades Great Again
Don't Do What Mark Did!
Buckle up for an episode full of laughter, intrigue, and insight as we delve into the evolving roles of journeymen and apprentices, share some hilarious tales of our old mate Justin, and discuss the increasing importance of technology in our industry.
We've all had a Justin in our lives - the guy who keeps things interesting, to say the least. Strap in for some workplace tales of deception and mystery that rival the best detective novels. When the dust settles, we find ourselves with some valuable lessons about the necessity of transparency and integrity in our work. We also put the spotlight on the apprentice-journeyman dynamic, discussing how apprentices stepping up their game can be a game-changer in shaping their careers.
Steering back to the future, we explore the impact of GPS technology on trade efficiency. The debate heats up as we weigh the pros and cons of this game-changing tool. Rounding off, we take a linguistic detour, comparing regional variations in trade terminology. It’s not just fun trivia, but a crucial reminder of clear communication’s role in our field. Whether a seasoned tradesman or a curious newcomer, this episode is your ticket to a fresh perspective on the industry. So, pull up a chair, pop in those earbuds, and come along for the ride!
Send us your feedback or topic ideas over on our social channels!
Eric Aune @mechanicalhub
Andy Mickelson @mick_plumb
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If you didn't answer the radio, that's because you were working, yeah, and so they do the same thing. Well, if we put cell phone at the front door and we just don't answer it, we're working, hey man, how are you doing Good?
Speaker 2:how are you Good? Good, everybody. Welcome to the Make Trades Great Again podcast. I am Eric and he is Andy. And today, Andy, you're on vacation, you're out of town.
Speaker 1:Yep, we are in the Panhandle of Florida. On a little big cave, just me and the Mrs, and I can't believe it.
Speaker 2:I can't believe you come in on your day off. That is amazing.
Speaker 1:Man, that's what we do. Somebody's got to do it.
Speaker 2:Somebody's got to make the sausage. Is that how it goes? You got to make the donuts.
Speaker 1:You want to keep the hordes happy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah you are. You're helping out the masses, hey, by the way, on that note, I guess coming into work on your day off, we don't recommend it, but we're going to talk about taking a day off instead of coming into work. I was reminded when we were chitchatting about some stuff before we hit record and we were just talking about how there are just all kinds of different characters everywhere in our lives and the trades are absolutely not immune to that Right, and reminded me of a story about an apprentice, justin, and his journeyman, mark, at a shop I used to work for. I don't, you don't remember. Did I already tell this story? I might have.
Speaker 1:I don't know if you have or not. I haven't heard. I don't feel like I've heard it, so I think it's a freshie.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, so Justin maybe wasn't like a super nice guy, Maybe not the sharpest knife in the drawer, I don't know. You know why. I've read that Doesn't probably even matter. But I just feel like if he hears this, I want him to hear me giving him a hard time, right? Ah no, I'm just kidding. He is a good guy, real nice guy. We went through our apprenticeship together. He was like a year behind me, I think. Same shop for a number of years and Justin one day, the new construction shop, lots of guys on the field, justin and then Mark are doing this big custom home someplace, you know whatever, probably on a golf course, and Justin calls into the shop looking for a material one. And that's maybe not the most normal thing, I think. Typically like if you had an apprentice and a journeyman in a truck, would you expect the apprentice to be calling in for materials or your journeyman?
Speaker 1:Typically I'm going to say it's going to be the journeyman, for sure. You know, I could see where it would be a little bit weird. But there may be an application here or there where the journeyman's like hey, call the shop and make, get this happening, sure sure, I think probably.
Speaker 2:Just, it's probably just like default, have the person in charge do it, but I guess maybe delegate it and, as you're trying to put more on to that apprentice, give them some more responsibility or just have them, you know, learning that part of the job too, because that is a, I mean, it's kind of a skill, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, I think it's probably more common as they get closer to their getting their journeyman license. You know, I mean as a young guy, I mean if the guy's, like, you know, week three, he's probably not calling in looking for the five eights rod hangers for half inch packs, right?
Speaker 2:You know. Well, see, that might be where we're at here, though I don't know the exact details, but all of this came together and was recounted through. You know how the shop communication channels go right. You know this guy says this it's like the game of telephone when you're a kid. You know like it starts out like I'm wearing a red shirt and at the end it's like my boobs hurt. You know what I mean. Like okay. So I'm going off of memory of like 20 years ago or more, well, more than that. And anyway, it also came up in a shop meeting. So there was discussion about this in a group context.
Speaker 2:But Justin calls it a shop looking for material, and I don't know why. But whatever, razor egg, red flag, maybe he was looking for five, eights rod couplings for the half inch packs. I have no idea. And and they JP. We had a full time shop guy. Jp was his name. He was a cool guy. I remember him.
Speaker 2:I used to, I was used to just think he was fun to talk to, character and kind of on his second career, that kind of guy. You know he had done a job, retired from it and then took this shop guy job and he would do deliveries, he would take orders, he would do a lot of things In the meantime. He's taken this order from Justin and he's like something right. And then maybe the red flag was his like why is Justin calling? You know, why not Mark, right? So like yeah, yeah, we'll, we'll get that out to you in a minute. Like does Mark need anything? And Justin did the old well, hold on, I'll ask. And and Justin came back and it was like apparently really awkward. That's a part I do remember. Like that whole part of the story being retold by JP was like I asked Justin if Mark need anything and I it just didn't seem like he even asked him. Yeah, yeah, yep, yep, exactly. And um, so JP is kind of like what the hell's going on? So I think what he did is he went and walked from the shop warehouse area into the office and like sums up, you know, like this is just weird.
Speaker 2:And so, um, pam, she was our like dispatch lady and she would do scheduling and stuff like that. And she calls Mark Now, this is the days of the next. Tell Okay, okay, beep, beep, you know. Hey, mark, are you there? You know that was God.
Speaker 2:That was a spot on impression of Pam. By the way, nobody would know it, but that was like exactly her. She died of an aneurysm on her way into work one day. Oh yeah, drove into somebody's living room. That sucks. Oh, that took a turn. Okay, let's get back on time. Sorry, I'm not laughing at her death, I'm just I don't know. Anyway, uh, rewind.
Speaker 2:So they she decides to call Mark on the next town. Mark answers maybe not right away, but then, of course, you know you're basically on speakerphone so you get to hear what's around you. It's a neck. These things are not drowning out noise, it's a next tell. It's basically like a hot mic, right. And um, she's like hey, yeah, mark, justin called in for some. Oh, he did, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, that sounds right. Okay, well, you guys are going to bring it out. And now Pam and JP are probably staying there on the other end of the next hell like going. Like sums up, this is what do you mean? Oh, yeah, he did. Yeah, okay, you're going to bring. Yeah, that's how it works, but we're calling you. Do you need anything? Or is there anything else we should add to the list? Maybe they were a long way from the shot, I don't know, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And they're trying to get to the bottom of this weird call to come in from Justin and he's he does the old here hold on? I'll ask Justin. And he keeps a phone on. He like must have like covered it up. And he's like hey, justin, do you need anything else? No, he's like, oh, you like this. Oh my God. And the only way this could have got better is if the FaceTime existed at the, in that moment of time you put him on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, why don't you put them on? So the material gets brought out to the job. But of course, at the job is just there's no truck there, there's no vehicle, just Justin's little car, yeah, no plumbing van. And that's when it just all kind of came together and I can see that that's when the puzzle pieces fell into place.
Speaker 2:So all the suspicion was not for not, basically. And JP's like hey, justin, where's Mark? Jp has like no authority in this situation other than he's an advanced age adult. You know, he's looking out for this apprentice who obviously was left on this job and his journeyman's just wherever. And Justin, I guess this I remember this pretty pretty accurately, I believe is that he was like, well, you know, he just ran to the store or something I think he's trying to cover for him. And JP must have stuck around just long enough to be like hey, justin, where's Mark? Like what, where's he really at Cause? Like he, if he just ran to the store, there's a Porta John right there, like what, you know, he didn't buy to go to the store. And finally he kind of spills the beans. He's like, yeah, he left like three hours ago and I'm not sure when he's coming back.
Speaker 2:And so then they called again and they get Mark on the phone and they're like hey, we're on the way to the job, just want to make sure you don't need anything one more time. Truck's kind of full and we're going to go to. You know, we got more deliveries, kind of deal. That's probably what they said and that's when he did the whole once again. Hey, justin, need anything you know covering his mouth, covering the speaker on the phone, just so it's enough, you know. Oh, no, we're good, you know one of these things. And oh, justin says we're good, and that's when the boss gets on the next L? Hey, mark, I'd like to know where you're at, cuz I'm standing here, or JP standing there with Justin. You know one of those deals? Yep, yeah, apparently he came clean, like right away. He's like oh, I'm golfing. He was out on the golf course, dude, oh, that's sneaky one.
Speaker 2:Oh, you try to pull the sneaky on me. I Don't even know what I would do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I.
Speaker 2:Would be so upset that somebody would try to take advantage of me, yeah, in that way, and then put that apprentice, I think a secondary. I'd be worried about the apprentice. I think that that's a. I'm gonna just say I think it's a dick move, yeah, but um, more importantly, like the guy's stealing from the company, like he's just like, is this the first time he's done it? Like, does this? This is something this guy does. What about when he didn't have an apprentice? Was he on the job all the time? Right?
Speaker 1:Hi, you know I have a similar. We had a shop boy that was at the company I was at before that went to the hardware store to get Spray paint. I think was what all he was going for. Going like ace hardware they go pick up a case of you know, flat black spray paint for the weld shop. You know our primer gray primer is probably what it was. You know we used to always spray all of paying all of our welds. You know, when they were done they'd Rattle can flat gray primer amount and yep, that's that's kind of the way it went. And I think they sent him to the shop or just sent him down to ace hardware to get the spray paint and and similar deal.
Speaker 1:You know, a couple hours goes by and they're like, huh, it's kind of weird. You know, took Jimmy a long time to make that parts around. I mean, ace hardware is like ten minutes down the road. Whatever must have. You know we must have sent him somewhere and didn't really recall that. We sent him there and Like, I don't like the three, two, three hour mark. We get it. Somebody gets a, the office gets a call from ace hardware. Hey, um, one of your guys is sitting in the truck in front of the store. Been here for a couple hours.
Speaker 1:Pretty, pretty sure he's asleep In the parking lot in the parking lot right in front of the store, like right at the sidewalk, like not at the back of the Park a lot, like you know next to the handicap spot in front.
Speaker 1:Oh man just passed out behind the wheel. Not passed out, but asleep, you know young kid, you know he comes back to the shop. Hey, I'm just like good nap, oh my god. But yeah, I don't know how you, I've never, I guess I've never had that, that thought even crossed my mind to be like hey, you know, I'm getting paid, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go do something else. You know, I just kind of odd.
Speaker 2:I. You know. It's crazy to me about that is that the company I worked for. I Just don't. I can't imagine too many scenarios where, if you asked for time off, they wouldn't just give it to you.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:This was during a time in our economy that there was there was more work than we could possibly finish. Weekly right, new construction building houses, one right after. I mean, if you left a job, they had three waiting for you. Right, right, you finish. You got your inspection on a rough end. They okay. You want to start this afternoon, you know. Yeah, shower units are already in the house and yeah, if you want to go start drilling it out, here's the paperwork, right, yep.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's a pipe sitting there right.
Speaker 2:But that said that also kind of like they were. They were a good company to work for, had been in business for a long time and their whole thing was is. In that scenario they were just like, yeah, we work these people all the time, like they work on the weekends. If we want them to like those, they gave you as many hours you want. Over time was not an issue, right, they paid and we're union shops, so I mean people were making good money because of how things were going and so taking a day off wasn't you know Right, wasn't gonna be denied most likely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I don't know. I mean that's, I don't know. It's wild to think somebody it was that it would be in your in the back of your mind that it would be Okay, or I mean, we're even worth around the golf. I mean, do you jeopardize your job for around a golf? I mean, does it?
Speaker 2:not me, I, I guess, maybe I'm just.
Speaker 1:You know, and I guess here's the deal in, in that scenario it's not just jeopardizing your job, it's jeopardizing your reputation. Right, those, those kinds of things don't go away. I remember I had a journeyman that we worked with, john Good guy, you know, always, always enjoyed working with John. Sure he in in in his prior, like years before, 10, 15 years before had a I don't, I don't remember what it was angle stop or something came off on a job that he rough, that he trimmed out and he flooded this house or flooded this building or whatever. Sucks, sucks his. His nickname forever and ever, and I think still to the to the day that he retired I feel like he retired a few years ago, to the day he retired was flood. That's what everybody called him. Everybody around town knew him as flood and you just go, okay, you know. So what's this guy's getting? You know nickname happy Gilmore, you know.
Speaker 2:That's probably around that time. That's funny. Yeah, yeah, juggers, the, the I don't. Yeah, I think he. I don't think he was around much long after that. He has brother worked there. I do know that he left the shop at one point in time and it might have been I don't. I'm muddy on the memory of when, timing of that. I'm guessing it was, definitely I'm guessing it was related to this incident, but he wasn't there for a number of years while I still was, his brother worked there as younger brother.
Speaker 2:There was three plumbers Mark, his younger brother, john, and they had an older brother who owned his own company okay but the two brothers didn't work for the older brother like, yeah, you know if that says anything the the funny thing. So we, we found out, like most of this through the grapevine. And then also it came, like I mentioned earlier, came up in a shop meeting. Right, we did. This was the company that had those monthly shop meetings that I think are super valuable, and they I look back to it thinking that you know, definitely something that a company with more than just one or two employees should probably be doing sitting down once a month and Hashing out some stuff, maybe training, things like that. Maybe you got to go over like, hey, this is what we don't do. We don't go golfing. Right, if you need time off, we'll give it to you. And what's funny, too, is like the boss was a big golfer. Both of both the owners were so like they're probably just like what an idiot. You know, if you would ask me of all people, I would have said yes, because I love golf or something, I don't know. Anyway, it wasn't long after that.
Speaker 2:It wasn't long after that, there was a few vehicles had got GPS put into them. Yep, I didn't have a van that did. I don't know why. I couldn't tell you why my van didn't get GPS. I think they started with a handful of trucks, right they, out, they.
Speaker 2:This shop was populated almost entirely by Chevy Express vans or GMC's, savannah's, you know, same thing and they started out fitting them with GPS.
Speaker 2:I think one of the functions of it I just remember the stir being, and like the some, somehow it started going around that they were trying to like like the kids sitting at the hardware store, yep, falling asleep, like they had a problem, I think, with builders calling in and like how come your guy sits in our, you know, the driveway at the job for 30 minutes every day, shows up, doesn't show up 30 minutes early, he just shows up but he doesn't get out of the truck, kind of deal, right, and I think that's why the GPS got put in.
Speaker 2:To be honest with you, yep, looking back on it, I think that was a normal occurrence and I, yeah, and it would get called in once in a while, because I think builders were like what the hell, why am I hiring you if you just, you know, your guys just show up and sit here, right, or maybe longer lunch breaks, that kind of thing, cause you know what they can do with that. And now I'm sure they can do way more, cause these vehicles are just outfitted with microchips right, with little transistors everywhere, but they could see when you got in and out of the vehicle, just based off of you sitting in your seat right, cause there'd be like a switch in the seat that would just say no sitting there. You know, that's basically what it came down to. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean, you get down to that point where you know I remember years ago we had a I assume it was. The conversation was spawned by the majority of us in the shop or not in the shop, but the majority of us in the that we're working out in the field were in the shop one morning and it was way past time for us to be. You know probably a lot of yak and carry it on about the weekend or whatever and one of the owners of the shop came down and walked into the shop and was like I'm sure he was taken back and it'll look like oh, cal, there's just like 15 people still here. What the why are there 15 guys here? And it's eight, 40 or whatever you know. And he, you know, barks off something. You know. Geez, you know I'm not paying you guys to stand around and you get your stuff and you get the heck out of here.
Speaker 1:You know that's, that's what this is about. And you know, and somebody, somebody kind of, oh geez, you know well, we're waiting on this and whatnot, and so he goes. Well, I'm not really looking for an excuse, but he goes. What I am looking for is some justification of why my dollar a minute Is being spent per guy, you know, right. And he goes, you start adding up the time, adding up the cost. You got 15 guys down in here to buck a minute. You know, and at the time I mean that was a while ago 60 bucks an hour or whatever you know, buck a minute for for 15 guys, for 40 minutes. Right, you know, there's a bunch of money getting wasted right here, and not to mention the fact the job is not getting done Well and you still have to drive to the job and you still have to set up and everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's all. Time lost is what it comes down to, and it's compounding. Well, and it was only a matter of time on those particular jobs where you end up with that kind of thing where pretty quick.
Speaker 1:Now the new policy is you call your stuff in at four the night before and you're, you're there in the shop to get your stuff and drive to the job. That's it. There's there's no reason why you should be picking material in the morning. You know that's the, that's the job guys, job we're keeping we're. You know he's coming in at 10 now or he's he's taking a three hour lunch break or or whatever. Or maybe there's a night guy that's coming in and stocking vehicles and pulling orders. You know from four PM on and you know maybe he works from four to six or four to eight or something like that and pulls those orders. But you know you really do use that. Look at the amount of time lost on that. And, like you say, I don't know, I enjoyed the heck out of those times. I made a lot of friendships yeah, absolutely With the guys you know, so I I.
Speaker 2:I remember that too.
Speaker 2:And I remembered being, you know, the young guy at the time when I got my license. I was the only journeyman that year, like new journeyman, right, does that make sense? Like I mean, there was plenty of journeymen that were older, been working there, but I was the only new licensed guy. And, uh, I just remember, just, you know, looking for that acceptance and knowing I was the young guy and just like sitting around and believe it or not, just more or less keeping my mouth shut and listening to these guys chit chat and stuff.
Speaker 2:And there was a lot of time wasted that way at the shop. That was that company that would, um, for a long time they would start the day. Guys would just drive in like every day, yeah, yeah, a lot of times early enough to where they could still get to their job at what we would call the starting time. But they would start their time when they got to the shop and they'd like throw a bag of like Su-Chief J hooks in the back of their van and be like, okay, you know, maybe they had to turn in some paperwork or something. I get that this is.
Speaker 2:You know, this was back in the day when everything was very analog, but um, yeah, the GPS thing though I never had to deal much with that because, like I said, my van didn't get it. I didn't stay at that company forever and I think it was really short lived, like you think they just like did this like trial thing. I suppose they had to spend a whole bunch of money to have them installed and stuff to like see it maybe if it was going to be the right thing for them. But since we didn't do like a dispatch service kind of business it was construction mostly they did have a couple of service guys. But um, I think that there was so much blowback on that GPS.
Speaker 2:I remember one dude in the tin shop quit because of it and everybody was like dude, if you don't have anything to worry about, like why are you so worried? That was that was. It was funny, because you would hear these guys bitch about it Like you can't be, you know they can't be doing. That that's BS. And then I think my privacy, yeah, it's my privacy. And then they would like like the dude leaves and they're like oh okay, it's paranoid.
Speaker 2:You're like wait a minute you guys are talking out of both sides of your mouth here and like it's kind of weird and the ultimately, I never really had that much of an opinion about it. Like I said, it wasn't in my vehicle. I also tend to think my brain goes this way and I'm not trying to justify one side or the other, but my brain went to, like well, it's their van, Like they, they let you drive it home and stuff like that. We got to, we got to drive this Parkham in our driveway. We didn't have to. In that case, we didn't even have to have our own personal vehicle, like not to go to work. We didn't, you know. No, and I think it, you know, is their vehicle, I guess if they want to put GPS on it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I remember us going through that and it was about the next tell era.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know to be honest, this would have been like maybe let's call it like 2003, 2004, maybe, Yep, we had I don't remember, I think it was through Verizon business.
Speaker 1:We had this dispatch software that was on the phones and so the, basically the, the shop could make a work order on the on the shop phone and then it could be dispatched to the tech through the cell phone and you had to go in and log, you know, click the, click through the steps and you know whatever and you get your, your work order and it had.
Speaker 1:You know it's a real crude version of what we've got. Well, the big kicker was and I remember, I remember playing into it the big kicker was it tracked your location, where you were at when you clicked each key pack, keystroke right. And I know for a fact that one of the texts that I used to work with had a one of the fake rocks, yeah, and he would put his cell phone in the rock and put it under the at the front porch and then take off and go to coffee. So it looked like he was at the job. It was at that address.
Speaker 2:And somebody.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just you know. And then and it was we had we had transitioned from a period where we were on radio, you know, like not CB radio but professional, like shortwave radio.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Our vehicle. Some of them had those in them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all of ours had radio in it, and so for years, if you didn't answer the radio, that's because you were working. Yeah, yeah, they would just like well, if we put cell phone at the front door and we just don't answer it, we're working.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's taken advantage of their trust right there. That's how they do it. That is that you can't argue that, yeah, it all broke down to.
Speaker 1:We don't want them to know where we're at. We don't. We don't want the boss to know, you know, we don't want to do the GPS tracking thing.
Speaker 2:Like you have some kind of autonomy, when in fact you're. They know you're supposed to be at a job site Like all they got to do. What are they? What? Are you so dumb that can't think they're not going to get in there, their Silverado, and drive out to the job, like what they're just like what are they handcuffed to their office chair, right, right.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, I don't. I don't know what the deal was. I think that ended up getting busted when the phone was ringing and the customer was sitting on the front porch or walked outside and was like what the heck is ringing. And there's this fake rock in the landscaping and fake rock.
Speaker 2:That's hilarious, you know. It's funny, though, if you talk, if you think about this in context of 2023, our phones, for so long, have had this capability built into them. Yeah, okay, so if it's a company phone, they can turn on tracking. Maybe you got to sign something because of the state you live in or something you know, whatever, but as like a condition of employment, sure. And now with the vehicles, there's telematics built right into them, like there's no need for you to hire out GPS. It's built into these vehicles. If you buy a new vehicle, it's in the vehicle, especially these work vehicles, and especially if it's got any kind of screen in it. That's smart.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's got XM radio. It's absolutely GPS built into it.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, hell, they could probably do it with some kind of regular FM signal. Now I don't even know.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, for all your vehicles that don't have GPS or telematics in it, there's just a little module that you plug right in that OBD port right on the underneath the dash. You just plug the thing in and it gets its power and powers up the GPS right now.
Speaker 2:Like the progressive or whatever the insurance company, like Safe Driver kind of thing. Yeah, I mean that's.
Speaker 1:GPS right there. When I used to run on GM vehicles, we had OnStar on a couple of vehicles. There you go and I mean my kids still do and we get a monthly report. How many hard stops do they have, how many hard accelerations do they have? And you can guarantee you the dad's saying hey, if I'm buying tires you're going to drive them nice.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Listen, Andy talks a big game. But those kids are there, is they? Just I?
Speaker 1:was kidding.
Speaker 2:Well, there you go. So don't be a mark, don't abandon adjusting, don't be that dude and don't be out on the golf course when all you had to do is say, hey, dude, I want to take this day off, my buddies want to go golfing, yeah, but ask for the day I don't call in. Do you say call in or call out? In Minnesota we say call in, call in sick. I don't know why, because then I hear call out and it makes more sense to me, like I'm calling out, I'm not going to. I don't know, I don't know what do you say? That's weird. You say call in, yeah. Do you stand in line or do you stand online?
Speaker 1:In line.
Speaker 2:In line. Yeah, us too, but you know what they do out on the east. Yeah, they're on line. They stand online. Yeah, like I'm standing online waiting for my turn, right, it's like literal to them. I guess standing in line is too. Yeah, I don't know. All right, well, that's enough of that. I'm going to hit stop on this recording. We're at 30 minutes. It was a good one. Do it All right, dude? Thanks, man, later See you.
