Make Trades Great Again
Whether you're a seasoned professional, a newcomer, or simply interested in the trades, the "Make Trades Great Again" podcast offers something for everyone. Our goal is to promote the value of skilled trades, provide essential resources, and build a strong community of passionate individuals.
Industry Insights - Educational Content - Community Stories - Technology in Trades
Tune in now and be part of the movement to make trades great again!
Make Trades Great Again
Now Hiring!
Ever wondered about the complex process of hiring plumbers and the hurdles that businesses face along the way? Today, we take an insightful journey into the plumbing industry, discussing the key challenges that come with hiring plumbers, from pre-employment checks for licenses and insurance to assessing the potential of candidates with past mistakes. If you’re involved in, or considering a career in the plumbing industry, you’ll find this discussion chock-full of practical insights.
We take a deep look into the licensing requirements of the plumbing industry and how to manage interviews with candidates who've had a rough past. We also shed light on the subtle art of maintaining fairness in hiring while aligning with business values. Wrapping up, we venture into the job market of Missoula, Montana, exploring the opportunities it presents for plumbers. Whether you’re a plumber looking to understand industry hiring practices, a business owner in the plumbing industry, or someone interested in the mechanisms of the labor market, this episode is a must-listen for you!
Send us your feedback or topic ideas over on our social channels!
Eric Aune @mechanicalhub
Andy Mickelson @mick_plumb
Newsletter sign up: https://bit.ly/MH_email
Your longest running employee outside of you is a guy you found on the IG. On the IG, it turns out to be a cool guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's our camera action right there. That's right. I was counting down and then I got to the. I knew the two one with the silencer things. Yeah, I do, I need to take one. Okay, dude Bonus episode Make trades great again podcast.
Speaker 1:How you doing, andy? I'm good, I'm good. We're here. We're here and we are going to talk about beer. No, no, we're not talking about beer. Probably too much talking about beer for the people we're going to talk about. Right, yeah, it could be, could be.
Speaker 1:So you're trying to hire yet again and this has turned into, as it is, for probably every single business owner, a huge challenge, a massive challenge here. What's the biggest challenges you're seeing right now with the hiring process? Well, I mean so, first off is you know it'd be great if there was this abundant hiring pool of license plumbers. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know what? I'm glad. The challenge in it? Well, but that's a huge challenge in our industry. Real quick, because in order for you to come work for me, I need you to have a license. So that's a big qualifier right there, not a driver's license like a literal state plumbing license. Yep, it's not nothing. Yep, it is. It is a big challenge and it's surprising because so we've done a handful of different online job posts.
Speaker 1:You know, looking for things. You know, hey, this is what we're looking for. You know, we're whatever and we spell it out. You know, license. You know, in the state of Montana, right, I don't really care. I mean, that's awesome if you've got a license somewhere else, but can you get one here? And are you willing to get one here? Because if you aren't, then don't apply. Sure, right, like, I mean, I don't know, we've had a handful, well, and I think they're just spam, basically, which is sucks. We've had a couple from, like, indonesia. Oh yeah, I get those on the DMs on Instagram, yeah, and I'm like, huh, that's interesting, I don't why. I mean, why are you? What is your goal here? What is your objective? You know, are you trying to fish down to do some sort of scam? Who knows? Probably, but some of them might actually just truly be looking for work in our country, which I understand, yeah, yeah, could be.
Speaker 1:But so having the license and having a license. In multiple facets of having a license, one a plumbing license, is definitely required. The second is a driver's license. A lot of what we do is drive, yeah, and if I can't insure you, then I can't hire you. Well, a, I mean the law says you can't have somebody work driving your vehicle simply if they just don't have a license, right. But when you say can't insure you, you're talking about kind of an altogether different scenario, correct? Yeah, yeah, and DWI or what I don't know.
Speaker 1:So we have taken the stance, and this was in the last couple of years. We've switched to a different insurance company. We were having some issues with the last one, just logistical things, not like we got canceled or anything like that. We were tired of having to call continuously to ask for this certificate so that it could be updated at the city, that kind of thing, yeah, all that kind of stuff. I know what you mean. I've been through that. It's frustrating. So we found a different company and they're a bigger firm and our insurance writer has several people that work under him for different facets of business insurance, which is great because we have these different contacts, like one particular individual is. I mean, basically all her job is is making sure that certificates are turned into where they're supposed to be. Sure, and that's awesome, because I can send her an email and, literally in minutes, the certificate is on its way to where it needs to be, right.
Speaker 1:So how does this affect your hiring, though? Like, what do you mean? Well, because we have somebody that handles all of our vehicle policies and I can send them a driver's license and say can I ensure this person? Oh, I got you Sure, you know, and so we've been been requesting that is, you know, can we do it? Because what I don't want to do is I don't want to hire somebody, have them come to day one and say, okay, here's your van, and then get a call from my insurance company and saying absolutely do not let them drive one of your vehicles which has happened to you not that scenario, but the they can't drive. So the ahead of time check, like the pre-check you've had recently, a couple of people come across. You know that may have been candidates for hire, and ultimately, you just had to tell them like, can't do it. I need you to be able to drive a vehicle, which is not an unreasonable requirement for employment. It just isn't.
Speaker 1:I've never worked. I've never worked anywhere where somebody on the crew didn't have to drive a vehicle. I can understand if you're working big commercial projects where you would drive your own show up to the job. That's not what we're talking about, no, well, and even in that case you still have to have a driver's license, right, technically? Yeah, I mean you shouldn't be out driving without them, although we know people do so. Yeah, I mean I know for the insurance thing, from my experience I had worked at a big shop big when I say you know like 30, 40 plumbers, residential, custom home, small commercial, so like a mix of different people, different skill levels, things like that and none of that matters when it comes to the logistics like you're talking about. Like literally, you have to be able to be insurable, you have to have a license.
Speaker 1:You know for the vehicle aspect of it and I this, my point is I've worked at this company years ago and all of a sudden, you know Craig was gone, like didn't work here anymore. We're like you know, it's one of the scenarios where you're like where's Craig? Man, I haven't seen him for a while. Maybe you're not buddies, you know, maybe you just see each other at the shop and passing and then come to find out. So I actually did work at that shop over two different cases, two different people. They were just like they. The shop let them go and it wasn't because they weren't good work, it was literally this like dude, you got a DWI six months ago. Why didn't you tell us, like we can't have you in our vehicles? Like that, right, there was enough for them to be like you're out man. You, you should have told us we're going to maybe figure this out, but not now.
Speaker 1:You know I have a buddy of mine that is a manager at another contracting firm, super job, superintendent type thing. Yeah, yeah, he, he does. Yeah, he tells me the other day we were talking, we were, I was on the phone talking about hunting or something like that. We're BS and then he goes. Oh my God, you know I was like we were talking about hiring people and you know I needed to hire another guy. You know it just comes up in conversation when you're talking with other contractors and he goes. Yeah, he goes, it's nuts, he goes, we, he goes.
Speaker 1:We just had a guy get arrested by the US Marshall at our office and the guy the guy had worked there for a couple of days and you know they turned in his information and that's how they tracked him, yep, and they, they caught it because his, his information came up on a job application or a IRS whatever. You know, probably a 1090 or a W2 or something like that went through and I don't know, I don't know exactly what the deal was, but he goes that. You know guys out in the shop, you know, getting ready to go for the morning, and they forgot that he used that alias somewhere else, something's. Oh man, so I mean, how do you even fix this? Though? Like, how do you? What do you say to somebody? Like somebody's out there listening right now and they're like I want to switch shops, like what do they got to think? Like what do you say to somebody that's in that scenario? I guess I guess here's, here's my, you know haven't come through it because I've never dealt with this before. I.
Speaker 1:We've always hired people that I've met, you know, in other facets. You know I've never been a cold call like interview or through a, you know, indeed, or whatever. Yeah, I feel like if, if these are things that are, are, are qualifiers, you I mean, I don't, I know it's, it's weird, and I can't discriminate against these. These folks, you know, be like oh, you know, I can't hurry if you don't have a driver's license, because technically I can, but if they can't perform the job duties in my particular application is driving, you know. I mean my, our guys drive all day long, basically. I mean there's days where you might be spend half the day in the in the van. Yeah, it's just a requirement of the job. Yeah, there's nothing illegal about that. No, and so in in, like you had mentioned. There are other jobs that are in this industry where you wouldn't drive at all during the day. Yeah, but you're not running the job site and you get yourself home from the job site, I mean that's. You're not running that business though. Yeah, but I think, I think something that I guess that it's not frustrating to me.
Speaker 1:It's frustrating to me that that I'm getting. I've gotten more than one, um, but I guess, before coming about it, just tell people right off the bat Let me know. Hey, you know what I? I made some stupid, I made a mistake, whatever. This is, this is what the scenario is and this is where I'm at with it, you know. So if I'm going to interview. I need to be. I should be thinking about this.
Speaker 1:I had a time and just be like, start the conversation. Look, before we go any further, I had a DWI five years ago, like is that going to be a problem? Yep, and and that's something that you know one of the guys had said well, you know that was three years ago. And I was like, okay, well, let's, let's find out. Um, so I bumped the bumped my insurance guy and he's like, yeah, he goes, we can't because because of the age and the nature of the incident, it's a five year minimum before he's insurable on a corporate policy. And didn't he also not have a license too? And that's something that the person said like, and we're not even sure he has a, he might have a suspended license or something Like wasn't that one? Yeah, and I don't know if the insurance, if the insurance guy, gets like details on what it is or if it's just here's these, these things, there's multiple infractions and there's a revoked license or something like that. I mean, I certainly don't have any information. That's privy, more than there's no driver's license and he's unable to be insured.
Speaker 1:Well, it probably is a level of which they pay right. So I know when Heather was at the boys and girls club for ever and ever, she had to do background checks on her potential employees Because obviously they're round kids and other people, stuff like that and um, so their background checks would come like there's like there's a way over simplifying it, but like option A and B. B costs more because you're going to get more detail, that kind of thing. It's probably what they, it's probably how they handle the insurance inquiry or something. Maybe if the insurance company just goes with the like the super option A, and then, if they need, they can pay more and get option. You know the details of B. Yeah, I don't know, maybe that's something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, and I guess that's where I say B forthcoming about it, because it's you know, if it's something that's going to be found out and be an issue. Man, it'd be a lot easier just to say it up front. I mean, I feel like I'm I'm a very you know, um reasonable person. If you explain to me what's going on and what happened. I mean you know what I get it. You know stuff happens. You make poor judgment calls and or you got stuck in a in the wrong place at the wrong time and you know what it happens. Yeah Well, it sucks too to even bring it up, because I think people listening, some people, somebody out there is probably thinking, and I'm just going to address it real quickly what does it matter? What do you care what this person did, if they're willing to show up and work and work hard, yeah, that, look. Any say, I'm all about it too.
Speaker 1:The fact of the matter is is there is another layer to this, when you're not thinking of it as a business owner. You're not necessarily thinking of it as I'm putting this, my name on the teacher of this person, and that person's going to be walking around in and out of people's homes. Their children are going to be around their elderly parents Look, just valuables Like I'm not assuming anybody that it doesn't have a driver's license. You go out, steal from people. That's not what I'm saying. Yeah, but we have to think about just overall how somebody represents our customer or our company in front of a customer, how they act, how they, you know, conduct themselves, and all mistakes are made. They are mistakes, but then also there are lifestyles and things like that, so it's just different. Yeah, I get it, man, that's got to be frustrating as heck.
Speaker 1:Just, I think one of the biggest challenges, too, because of where you live, because of where I live, where I wish this was nationwide, but it's unfortunately it's not, but is initially just that trade license or competency card or whatever, however it is, establish where you are. That is the first and foremost qualifier, because I don't care what gender you are, I don't care what color your hair is, I don't like. None of that even matters, and honestly I don't. I hate to say it this way, but I'm going to say it bluntly I don't care how good you are or not good you are at your job because, no matter what, first and foremost, if you don't have that Minnesota estate plumbing license that I am required to have, you are required to have to come work for me. Then none of that other stuff is really a factor, unfortunately, and we're not talking again, let me add this we're not talking about potential employees who could be joining an apprenticeship program or anything like that. We're talking about literally you're, you are. We're saying all of this because you are trying to find somebody that already has their license that can come and go do work for you. Yep, yep, exactly, and that's. I guess that's kind of where where I'm at with it is.
Speaker 1:The state of Montana has a reciprocal agreement with all of the states that border Montana. So Idaho, utah, wyoming, south Dakota, north Dakota if you have a license and active license in those states, I think, I think it's just a matter of applying in the state of Montana. Wow, that's super. Yeah, that's awesome. If you're a plumber in Idaho and you want to move to Montana, like seriously, yeah, like that's, we don't have that here. I wish we did Right.
Speaker 1:So now, if you're from Washington, you have to apply for a temporary license and then take the Montana State plumbing test, simply because of distance, not distance, and, yeah, jurisdictions, I guess, different codes. Well, you know, the toilets flushed differently in Washington. It's, yeah, it's the gravitational pull in the direction that the sun comes up is different to. Yep, Yep, I think it's a longitudinal axis of the invertebrate, uh, rubbery girder. That's what it is. Yeah, yeah, flux monsters.
Speaker 1:All right, dude, we're wrapping it. That was a bonus. Wrap it up. There you are. Have a good one, everybody, all right. Oh, wait, wait, what I was just going to say? Shameless plug, shameless plug. If you have interest in moving to Missoula, montana, hit me up please. Hey, you have an employee that, uh, yeah, your your your longest term, your longest running employee outside of you is a guy you found on the IG. Yeah, on the IG it turns out to be a cool guy, yeah. So, like I said, if you're, if you're interested, you know, follow us on IG. Um, give us a look up, if you're, if you like what you're hearing, you want to give it a shot? Let me know I can't do it. We're hiring. I appreciate that. I hope somebody does reach out and has a license or as well as license, or as willing to get it. Yeah, all right, dude, all right. Thanks, everybody. Have a good one, you too.
