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Trust But Verify! Dealing with job challenges.
Ever had a colossal blunder on your hands that resulted in a rooftop unit curb adapter not fitting the new unit? Well, that was us. Join us as we dissect this recent debacle, from our oversight of not getting the spec sheet for the curb adapter, to dealing with a reversed supply and return situation. We'll share some hard-learned lessons on the importance of acquiring the right information beforehand, and how a simple mistake can quickly escalate into a logistical nightmare.
Moving onto delivery issues, we came across a surprise when a rooftop unit arrived earlier than expected, and had been opened even before delivery. Throw in a poorly packaged boiler to the mix, and you have a recipe for frustration. But there's always a silver lining in these experiences. We'll share how these predicaments reinforced the necessity of equipment verification, preventive measures, and the significance of addressing such issues head-on to prevent them from recurring. So tune in, as we share our experiences and the lessons we've learned from these recent challenges in the field.
Send us your feedback or topic ideas over on our social channels!
Eric Aune @mechanicalhub
Andy Mickelson @mick_plumb
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1035 instead of a 1036 and you have the wrong. We've got the wrong. Curve back. Oh my God, come on.
Speaker 2:Bonus episode dude Bonus. Here we are. Should we, should we change it from bonus to something else? Like is there something like cool names? You can come up with spicy extra, spicy extra topics, spicy info.
Speaker 1:MTA Extra spicy After dark, oh or before, before light, before sunrise.
Speaker 2:Before welcome to MTA before sunrise. Um, andy, let's, let's get right into it. Yeah, you've had some equipment issues.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've had some equipment issues. Um, you know, in this this is a. I don't want this to come out as a dig towards the wholesale house, because it's certainly not. I respect the guys. Um, I appreciate working with them. It is it's purely it's a mistake, you know it's, it's one of those things that happens and it and it sucks, but um, and so I'm not going to bring up the the wholesale house that that is involved. Um, they are making right. Um, doing the best that they can to to resolve the situation. So here's where we're at.
Speaker 1:Um, we've had a had a rooftop unit that we replaced here a few weeks ago, three weeks ago, some four weeks ago. Um, we get the rooftop unit. I didn't get a copy of the spec sheet on the curb adapter and I that was stupid on my part, um, cause I should have followed up on it. I was like, oh sweet, they got the curb, no big deal. They know exactly what's going to go on here. These guys are professionals. They've always done great work for me in the past and we ordered it Right. Yeah, sold the job, ordered it, blah, blah, blah. Long story short. Uh, rooftop shows up. We get the crane scheduled.
Speaker 1:Um, pull the old rooftop off the off the roof, um, fly the new curb adapter up there. Curb adapter doesn't fit right, something's a little bit wonky. And we're looking at it like what the heck? And at the same, you know, by the time we're kind of getting that figured out, miles is on the roof, I'm on the ground, rig in the the rooftop, we fly the new rooftop up there and as I get up on the roof to help, you know, signal this thing in or get it put in place, he's like the curb adapter's not right. And I'm like, okay, hang on a sec. So we get the crane to hold. So he's basically holding this unit, you know, 10 feet above the roof.
Speaker 1:And we're trying to figure out like what's? What's wrong with this curb adapter? Is it something we can field fix or field modify to make it work? And it just is no, there's no way it's going to work. Oh, my God, dang it.
Speaker 1:So put a call into the supply house. I'm like, hey, we got a problem. Can you verify model numbers of old unit versus new unit? Is this the right curb adapter? Blah, blah, blah. And they're like yeah, we'll get back to you. So in the meantime we're like well, now what? So in that particular case, the new unit would was significantly small, smaller than the old curb, yeah, and so we just decided well, we're just going to set the new unit on a couple of stickers on the roof. Um building was a red iron barjoy system throughout. There wasn't any any special support and it wasn't a very big unit. So we just set it on the roof, panned off the the hole and we're like, all right, we'll, we'll figure it out in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 1:Long story, we go to rooftop unit number two. Yeah, at that point in time I called and I'm like can you verify? You know, can you send me specs on the on the curb adapter for the second unit? Yeah, yeah, different buildings. So we go downtown. I, you know, look at miles that already put the specs in his uh, in his uh workup, when we were there, when he found the failed heat exchanger, and so he had already had the measurements. I'm like, yep, no, curb adapter looks right, it looks correct, it fits. Yep, yep, yep, okay, looks fine. And so we call back to the supply house. I'm like, yeah, no, according to the dimensions, everything looks like it's fine. The dimension size is fine.
Speaker 1:However, the new unit, the supply and return are reversed from what the old unit was. We were taken out of train, put in a dyke and and it had to rotate 90 degrees on the curb adapter. And it was one of those things that we show up. Yesterday morning or yesterday afternoon at midday, 11 o'clock, crane shows up, he gets done with his previous job. He's like, hey, I'm ready to go. We kind of all roll on the site at the same time. Miles jumps on the roof, whack you know, pulls a disconnect off and does a couple of things to get it disconnected and we fly the new curb adapter up there first, yeah, fly the old unit off. New units coming up and we're looking at the curb adapter again and I'm like wait, what the what the heck? It doesn't like, it doesn't fit the curb Like that. No, that's not the dimensions we gave. You know what's going on here and I still, I, still, I, still, I, still this ahead of time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because you had trouble with the first one, this is your second one. We're not working again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I'm like what in the world is going on here? And I, somewhere along the line on the second unit, the, there was a I don't know if it was a C was turned into an E. On the, you know it was a revision change and so in the old train unit, this, the difference between a C and an E was who knows what I mean something physically changed and the new unit has to be rotated. This, the C model, that that they ordered the curb for, apparently didn't Sure, and so now we have this curb, you know this $1,500 curb adapter, that's like we approved it and I mean, and rightfully, the you know, because I don't, on the submittal you get, well, here's the curb adapter, blah, blah, blah. It fits these couple of models. Well, it doesn't really say.
Speaker 1:There's a note on there and I didn't quite understand the note. I'm trying to remember what it said. Something you know, solid, solid, top, horizontal, and I was like I think that this is made for a ducted unit, like if you were modifying the existing curb to be a horizontally ducted unit, and it was a little bit weird and a little bit vague. And when, when I called the supply house, they were like read me off the model number for the old unit, and as soon as I did, he's like oh, that's what we did. Yeah, we ordered you a 1035 instead of a 1036. And you have the wrong, we got the wrong curb. Oh my God. Oh my God, come on. You know so this office building has been without heat since September 5th. Yeah, no big deal, it's only right so it's now.
Speaker 1:November 1st and you know, and so this it's a an architecture office has had had no heat for, you know, the last two months and and now we're got another couple of weeks before we're we're ready to roll, but it'd be kind of interesting.
Speaker 2:Didn't you fly some in yesterday and know what you were working on yesterday? That?
Speaker 1:was. That was the second. No, that we did the finish the first one last week because that new adapter came in and now we're about two weeks from getting the right adapter on the new one.
Speaker 2:My head is spinning here, dude. I, you know, I I just ordered some parts for a couple older commercial type of Eastman boilers. It's a rack system, One of the fan, one of the rotary fans they call it, but it's, you know, the inducer. Yeah, one of them of the three is bad, and then I got a flow switch that's not making, and so all together, I'm ordering parts for these. What are they now?
Speaker 2:17 year old boilers that are in perfectly good condition, amazingly, and it's just, I've got enough experience to know that I'm going to get the parts I need. But they're obscure enough and like they're not clear in part numbers and stuff, because there's so many variations to these boilers over the years, and sourcing the OEM parts that weren't made by V-SPAN, all this kind of stuff, and I'm worried that I'm going to get the wrong curb adapter in the sense that there are two rotary fans for these things, depending on, like, what plant that came out of in the Ukraine or something. You know what I mean. Like it's literally that and I'm thinking, but the only saving grace is I needed one flow switch. There's three boilers, so I ordered three or three flow switches.
Speaker 2:The other two will just sit there. I won't even change them, you know, but we'll have them. It's a greenhouse, it's in my town, that literally it's three miles from my house right on the.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's a simple, simple drive and I have a good relationship with them. They call me. I didn't install these as they're old, but I just the other thing, the saving, you know, the one thing I said, you know, kind of saving grace is that Johnstone, my guy, I call him up and I'm like Tom, I need this and this is from the V-SPAN tech support, given the numbers, is like I have that fan in Bloomington and I'm like no freaking way. That's what made me a little nervous, because I'm like you might have, you might think you have the fan, but I think it's going to be the other one, like in my head, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But I trust the guy, I trust Tom, like Corbel was we call him, his last name is Corbel. I'm like Corbel, come on, dude, don't, don't be messing with me. He's like no, I have it. And I'm like well, that's cool. And I said saving grace because, like I guess, if it's not, I didn't ship it from Rhode Island. I can return it to Johnstone, but I can't return. You know, you buy it as soon as it comes out of Rhode Island. So, as you know, I've got a couple parts here that are just sitting there.
Speaker 1:I don't need them right now, but I'm hoping I do. I got a gas valve, yup, or I got a gas valve sitting on the shelf.
Speaker 2:That's a similar situation or refractory kit for a WB2B the box is the size of a you know truck wheel, yeah. Anyway, it's tough to verify that kind of stuff you don't know, because you have to have that trust and relationship and hope that your source is getting it right, because these are qualified people, they're in business for you know they're not regularly making mistakes, right no? But it sucks, especially when your customer is sitting. You know, like you said, no heat for how long.
Speaker 1:You know it's crazy, Right, Right. You know, luckily, that you know the office the architecture office is is they're already geared up with space heaters because they've already been accustomed to it. So you know what it's just kind of is what it is and they were all cool with it. You know they're like, oh, that sucks, you know. Well, all right, and originally we had told them the unit wasn't even supposed to ship until like yesterday or two days, the 29th or something like that, from the factory, and then it was going to go from the factory to Vancouver Washington and then get unloaded at a distribution center and then make its way from Vancouver Washington back to Missoula, and I mean, it was going to be like a couple of weeks from now anyway. Sure, and so we're, we're ahead of schedule. We got a delivery. I don't know. I don't know what changed in it, but it shipped from the factory faster.
Speaker 2:So under promise over delivery, that's what happened. The same thing. Yeah, so you're that are fairies? All right, dude. Yeah, let's do it. Verify your equipment, and then yeah, and then still get the rocks.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so that was the conversation. You know, I went in and had a conversation with the manager yesterday and and I'm like you know what do? What do I do? What do we do different? Right, like, like you know what problems already happened that we're not, we're not going to fix that? We can't fix that. We, this has got messed up twice, right, how do we fix it in the next time? What do I need to be doing to make sure that you guys have what you need, so that I got what I need? You know, because I mean, this is, it's not, it's a partnership that I want to continue. You know, I don't want, I don't want to not buy from this supply house. Has it cost me money? Yes, has it cost me time? Yes, they're doing what they can to make it right and that's fine. Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 2:That's it too. I you know this same Corbo. I emailed them a few weeks ago because I took delivery of a couple boilers and one of them had the straps cut off. Yeah, yeah, of the venitans. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1:That's bad news. You can't cut the straps. It means that somebody has taken it out of the box. Well, no, I question that like right out of the gate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but you can't even show us up. You can't move this boiler without having the straps around the cardboard, because the cardboard keeps the whole thing together. It's the dumbest design ever basement.
Speaker 1:But but you know, and I'm, and I'm fine with it because you know what it does. It gives me that opportunity to go. This boiler has been open. Somebody has opened this box. They've taken something out of it and then put something back. I don't want it.
Speaker 2:You're, you're very positive in that outlook. I'll say positive because I know what you're saying. Like I disagree I, although I can't, I don't disagree. I know you're right. But my first inclination or my first thought was is great, now I have a boiler that doesn't have a package. It may as well just not have showed up in a box because that's because of literally the factory packaging like that. Absolutely. Those two plastic straps keep everything intact in where they're supposed to go?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I did open it.
Speaker 2:They opened it in the shop. I come to find out they opened it before they brought it to me, like literally that day, because the bottom of the pallet was broke on one end. They're like so we open it up. I'm like the one thing you can't do is open this.
Speaker 2:Well, if you do, open it, then at least band iron it back together. They should have done that, and I even so. I sent this email, and it was a priest. I'm not one to do that, but I'm like you can't do this. Here's why I'm really, really disappointed. Now I've got to know I have to have somebody help me load and unload this thing. It's a $4000 boiler, but you know like this is not cool. Yeah, yeah, because of two plastic straps, and it's not your fault that the factory packages it this way, but you can't undo the packaging.
Speaker 2:All this goes into now it's going to cost me money, yeah, and. And so then I had that face to face over the phone, was over the phone, but I had the actual conversation with Corbel yesterday, same as you did. You went in, you talked to him like how are we going to fix this? I'm on the phone, I'm dealing with something else, I'm ordering those parts. And then I said, hey, and about that email that you don't normally get for me, bitching at you about this. But I had to kind of explain myself. I'm like I need you to know how important it is that this doesn't happen for all the reasons.
Speaker 1:This isn't the first time, any package has been opened.
Speaker 2:Right, I'm not, you know I'm not special and I'm not thinking you got to treat me different, but but for the stupid, you know for the all the reasons, like this boiler should not be packaged like that. You can't undo it. You know what I mean. Like, that's what I meant about yeah, so yeah, it's frustrating. Yep For sure. Right on, brother, I'm hitting an end right now. Do it Stop?
Speaker 1:Stop, bye, bye.
